how to support the antisemites from hamas?
aber argumenten scheint die allianz aus antisemitInnen und israelhassern ja nicht zugänglich zu sein

«Propaganda Suggestion #2: You are being undermined and assaulted by radicals. It is said that the radicals are violent. It is believed that they are deranged and must be stopped.»

yes, of course the hamas is a peace-organisation 0o

And of course Israel too...^^

israel is a state, which has to protect itz citizens against attackers, which have the aim to murder that much jews as possible, IF israel would have a in a way similar ideology, gaza wouldnt exist anymore, the IDF has the tools to "solve" that in less then 5 minutes, but that will not happen, because israel is a liberal pluralistic democracy, in opposite to gaza/hamas.
if you dont understand that, i make it more easy, if hamas would have the bomb, israel would be allready history and we would had another holocaust, israel HAS the bomb and gaza/the "palestinians" and the hamas still exist

ps without attacking the border, which is internationaly considered as an act of war, no dead "palestinians"

I don't think logic is very convincing tool here to discuss about the problem (if... then etc.), because both side can use it (without fallacy) in a never ending battle of arguments...

From my understanding of the problem, borders of Israel are not defined yet because this state is born in a state of war, never reaching the peace treaties that grants and establish his borders. So strictly speaking, as the borders are not established yet, both side can claim about the acting of the enemies as an act of war (and so giving them in you perspective, the right to kill enemies doing so [a perspective i tend to disagree with]).

As i see it, from my understanding, the creation of Israel itself appears to be, from the very beginning, an act of war against people living here before them.

Of course, this fact should not be, in my point of view, a reason to destroy this state, now that it obviously and strongly exists. But it should prevent from trying to justify violence using the violence of the enemies you wish to destroy. Violence has roots; there is no devil, nor bad people. This roots have to be heard, understood, and healed: that is the only way.

ok, if you dont want logic in that debate, we shouldnt debate, every state is a product of war, you should get a history book to get some facts and the aim of hamas is not to destroy israel as a state and to establish a state, it is murder much jews as possible

Yeah... Why this ton...

I don't say that i don't want logic. I say your are using logic as a dogmatic way to convince yourself you are right. Both side can do that...

Of course every state is the product of war (it is exactly what i meant). And the borders of this same states are established by treaties of peace.

You are indeed reducing Palestinian (and Gaza people) to Hamas. It is a rhetorical tool for propaganda.

Don't you have extremists in Israel? (Yes you have). Are they not nowadays indeed governing the country? (Yes they are). Are all the people of Israel (and all the Jew in the world supporting this extremist? (No they are not).

Indeed it is about facts, and there interpretation by different side of the story. If you don't consider this interpretations as constituting a part of this facts, you are just ignoring the part of reality that would make you able to get out your dogmatic point of view.

But of course i must be an ignorant antisemitic...

no, i reduce the the border-attackes on hamas, there are some more, the pflp, the holy jihad, the al aksa brigades, the islamic state in gaza etc and yes, the (new)kach-party or lehava are nearly so shitty like hamas, but the (new) kach-movement is forbidden in israel and lehava is a small right wing organisation

and you deny the fact, that israel offered peace and secure borders to itz neighbours several time, from the first day of israels existence, it was the "rab" side which allways choose war (that why i recomannd a history book) and in israel/palestine live jews since more then 2000years, 800 000 jewish "arabs" had been expelled since israels founding by the arabs states (did i mention a history book?), if you ignore these facts, you are obviously ignorant, or an antisemite, i dont know you, maybe you are, maybe not

the aim of hamas is not to destroy israel as a state and to establish a state, it is murder much jews as possible --> do you mean that before 1948 palestinian has only one aim: kill much jews as possible ? Before occident went and made a mess, they were living together overthere...

no, i didnt meant that, i would never claim, that this is the aim of "all palestinians", because it isnt, but the founder of the palestinian national movement, the mufti al husseeini was an antisemite, before he visited europe, the and no, it wasnt everything nice and chill in the ottoman empire

why didn't they create the jewish state in the USA ?