Et on ne connais pas encore es conséquence sur la santé de ces injections qui ne servent a rien ...
Et bien évidement quand elles arriveront il n'y aura pas de responsable ...

I suppose important thing which is ignored, is that vaccines are not equally successful against various mutations. I know it is mentioned here and there, but as you said itbisna hammer and nail problem. What they says "settled science driven policy" is just propaganda of not well educated media gig workers and corrupted politicians.
And remember: it is not about civid only. If they use science word that means they refer to something they have no idea about. Always

Alors +1 sur le fait que "quand on a un marteau on ne voit que des clous", le vaccin ne devrait pas être l'alpha et l'oméga de toute la politique sanitaire.
Et emmerder les gens pour passer de 80 à 90% de vaccinés en France, c'est tout de suite + débile si on compte que ça fait passer la vaccination mondiale de 50% à 50,7% (et tant qu'on aura autant d'avions plein d'hommes d'affaires, c'est ça qu'il faudra regarder)

Politiquement parlant, c'est le gros bordel et la course aux alibis, surtout avec les élections.

Par contre, médicalement parlant, ça ne veut pas dire que ça n'a pas d'effet.
10 clous seuls ne tiendront pas une étagère. Par contre 2 clous + 2 vis c'est en général le + efficace.

non mais là on est dans une situation ou la vaccination de masse est contrainte à partir de 12 ans par des procédés de merde (qui ont déformé un peu plus notre corpus législatif), en dessous de 12 ans elle est encore bien poussée officiellement (mais ça marche pas), donc merde, ras le cu de répéter que ça protège des formes graves: faut déjà arrêter le délire.
Si on se met à distribuer du xanax à tout le monde, je suis sûr que ça bénéficiera à quelques uns, tant mieux, en attendant c une idée débile de distribuer du xanax à tout le monde sous peine de mort sociale.

Ah mais politiquement les choix sont de la grosse merde, tu as complètement raison.
La dernière, ce serait une "suspension du passe vaccinal" juste le temps de la campagne de macron...

ouais on le sent bien comme ça hein.. on s'enfonce dans un truc, mazette, faut que cette élection présidentielle soit explosive pas moins, sinon on fonce droit dans le trou là.
Putain un second mandat de macron, il va tout donner on s'en relèvera pas.

@Kazimierz Kurz yeah mutations, immunity decay, with only those 2 parameters you explain a lot of thing. But clearly we're not in an explain mode, rather in a very deep eat that shit and keep on shopping trend.
Those are complex problems we're just incapable of treating correctly. I'm so pissed off by all that, we have the tools, we have the theories, we made tremendous progresses with genetics, all that for a stupid political propaganda and a blind application of a piece of technology, as if it was the philosophal stone. We're just so fucked up, spoiled children.

One of the biggest achievment of governments all over the world (helped by some fools), is to destroy our possibilities to find a valuable information.

Now, the opinion of "Bob from the pub" is at the same level than any good scientist, and governments use that to speak their own "truth".
There is no more facts, only opinions.

One of the biggest achievement of governments all over the world (helped by some fools), is to destroy our possibilities to find a valuable information.

More than this they promote false information : vaccine effectiveness, side effects inexistent .... Remember what Verran and Casteix was saying last summer, everything should be over by september.

Why all data are not available ? Only partial data ... without Vaccination status for instance.
It could be helpful to clarify all the shit that is being broadcasted in the news mainly.

Les effets sur les personnes jeunes sans facteurs de risque yen a bien, aucun doutes, tous ceux que je connais on eu 2 semaine de repos forcé ...

...
and some antivaxxer said covid doesn't exist, or talked about 5G microchips.

If those fools are not a good argument against your ideas,
then governments' lies are not an argument against vaccine.

(and 2 weeks of fatigue was annouced and expected, It is good for me as it is far from "lots of deaths" predicted by some "alternative journals")

and some antivaxxer said covid doesn’t exist, or talked about 5G microchips.

This is not the topic here !
This is you who introduce the confusion it seems ....

(and 2 weeks of fatigue was annouced and expected, It is good for me as it is far from “lots of deaths” predicted by some “alternative journals”)

I am talking about people < 30 here (collegue from work) ....
All sick ...

Yes, a little sick, and better after that.
It is really common if you take a flu vaccine, since decades we know about this kind of effects.

If 5G is not the topic, Castex' lies are not an argument about dangers of vaccines.
If Castex (a non-scientist) is a valable argument, then 5G is also a valable argument.

Why all data are not available ? Only partial data ... without Vaccination status for instance.

I suppose the simplest reason: there is no data. Famous websites like worldometers rely on Twitter data for example. In a world full of electronic devices and survivalence there is no credible way to get this in raw. You have to rely on government data, gathered manually from hospital systems. I do not complain here about fake data or planned misinformation ( I do not know if any such even exists). I am complaining about bad data quality and low speed it is available. It may look innocent but it have serious consequences.

Most of the democratic governments want us to believe their policies are founded in data. It even may be true to some extent. But data acquisition usually works in a way supporting governments agendas driven by lobbyists. So for example you can have data about vaccination and illness, but data about lines among vaccinated is nearly no reported. I do not say it is intentionally hidden. It just does not get enough attention. And probably a lot of similar phenomenon has place.

So governments want us to believe they have data driven policies, while most of the time, they just choose what lobbying want, and search for the data ( usually provided by lobbyists, this is BTW they job...to provide arguments) supporting this, chosen before polices. it is anti science scheme At science you are looking for data which does not support your hypothesis. Or provide experiments which may falsify your theory. Science does not look for data supporting hypothesis because hypothesis is based on facts in the first place - nobody in science is making hypothesis in conflict with data. In politics however it is typical, you have policy which makes people lives worse, more costly or less free. But your job as corrupted politician is to find arguments supporting that policies, even as they are completely falsified with data. That's how policies like "more survivalence makes more safety fot freedom" polices grows up. And this is lobbying job to provide such data to support profitable for oligarchy policies. It has data! It may be true! But it is usually manipulation and anti science at the same time. Science doesn't look for data conforming theories. Science looks for data which falsifies it.

government data

I agree, they provide some publicly ...
the main that is not public is Hospitalization and Emergency care by vaccination status ... you have to rely about their voice

These data is no publicized ...

Governments don't want data, but not only because it would show they are wrong.
They need to be sure everybody is doubting.

The problem with not-publicized data... is that anybody can invent its own and say anything.

@kakaz@pluspora.com you are right, science looks for data able to falsifies theories.
But if a data is too much unbelievable, it has big chances to be wrong or fake.

les enfants meurent (ils ne sont pas vaccinés), les français sont des veaux (ils ne veulent pas vacciner leurs enfants), et grâce à la sainte vaccination on a évité une catastrophe nucléaire, amen, show must go on...
https://twitter.com/franceinfo/status/1493854245132685315

quelqu'un a des chiffres récents sur les suicides ?

C'est un menteur, (pas un scoop)
Mais quelqu'un qui dirait "s'il ne se protège pas, le gamin ne risque rien", c'est un menteur aussi.